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Weight Distribution, Sway Control, and all that…..

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11:42 am
February 22, 2012


Mike J

Kingston WA

Member

posts 30

Post edited 6:46 pm – February 22, 2012 by Mike J


While I haven't noticed these systems on small travel trailers, I have seen them referred to in forums. What would be the need, advantage, of having weight distribution and sway control systems on a Sportsmen Classic 14RB. I tow with a 2009 RAV4 6 cyl., which does well, except that when hitched the trailer tongue and car hitch do drop down considerably – – certainly not a straight line! Would such a system correct this? Appreciate comment and suggestions.

Mike

2010 KZ Sportsmen Classic 14RB – 2009 RAV4 V6

12:23 pm
February 22, 2012


sandersmr

Texas

Member

posts 338

Sounds like you would be a candidate for weight distribution.  It acts as a fulcrum to redestribute some of the weight back to the front wheels of the TV and the axle of the trailer.

Sway control, while it may be integrated into the WDS, is actually to keep the trailer in a mostly straight line behind the TV and to keep it from swaying side to side.

2010 16BH towed by 2002 F-150 Super Crew 4.6L V8

4:26 pm
February 22, 2012


Mike Magee

near Tulsa OK

Member

posts 204

WD would move some of the load off of your rear axle and onto [1] the front axle and [2] the trailer's axle.  It may be best to avoid WD systems with no "give" in their method of WD; for example, the Equal-i-zer's bars are square and won't really flex.  A springy trunnion bar is better for unibody vehicles like ours. 

Another interesting possibility is the new Anderson anti-sway hitch, which uses taut chains with flexible bushings at the chain ends to provide the WD; they claim that the bushings take much of the shock out of bumps and provide a better ride.  However, they are not yet producing one that's compatible with a 2″ ball… it may be a few months.  When they come out with a 2″, I will be tempted.

2008 Toyota Highlander – 2011 Escape E14RB

4:45 pm
February 22, 2012


DougB

Charlotte, NC

Member

posts 31

I have a RAV and had the same issue.  I considered a WD system but there are a couple of things that stopped me from it. 

First the hitch receiver is very low on the RAV so I think there will be an issue with the shank/head being too close to the ground.

Second the RAV is unibody vs. frame and I have read that WD systems put too much twist on the body.  On some of the forums people have said there were warnings in the past from Toyota saying not to use WD with the RAV.  I called the dealer and they searched and didn't find any warnings.  On the other hand many trucks will have a different tongue limit with and without WD and there is no mention of that with the RAV OEM hitch receiver.  If you don't have the OEM hitch receiver I would be particularly concerned since the OEM one has many more connection points and stiffeners than what I've seen with aftermarket hitchs.

In the end I went with an air bag spring helper, the only one I could find was from Firestone.  It helps tremendously.  But you have to be aware that the hitch weight limit is 350lbs and is easily exceeded with a propane tank, battery, etc.  So I would start with weighing the trailer hitch, mine was over 400lbs.

Sorry for the long winded response but hopefully it helps.  If you need any more details I'll be happy to provide.

2010 16BH; RAV4 V6

12:31 am
February 23, 2012


smilinjohn

Minnesota Prairie

Moderator

posts 380

For our former Ford Explorer V8, I ended up installing Husky Helper Springs for about $100 + tax, available from http://www.HuskySpring.com , St. Cloud, MN.  The Husky Helper Spring assembly added to each rear leaf spring increased the maximum tonge weight for our Class III hitch to 1,000 lbs. maximum, eliminating the need for other Weight Distribution systems.  The addition of the Husky Springs eliminated the rear sag.

Sway control on any, up to 15 foot travel trailer is next to unnecessary.  Our 14RK, without sway control, has never swayed.

SmileJohn

2010 Sportsmen Classic 14RK; 2005 Ford F-150, 5.4L V8; "…..it is always advisable to perceive clearly our ignorance." Charles Darwin

9:48 am
February 24, 2012


Suzy-Q

Oklahoma

Member

posts 54

We have the 2010 14RK and had a little sag with our 2004 GMC Safari.  We replaced the shocks with Gabriel air adjustable shocks from Autozone for $64.  No need for WDH unless there is an overload on the rear axle.  No sway control either. 

HTH;

John


2010 14RK , 300W solar

11:45 am
February 24, 2012


Mike J

Kingston WA

Member

posts 30

Post edited 6:46 pm – February 24, 2012 by Mike J


Thanks, All,

Your replies really appreciated.

Lots of follow-up checking and searching and the unibody issue appears critical, hence no WDS being considered. The Husky Helper Springs might be a possibility, although Toyota RAV4 is not listed in the Husky page, so I'm waiting for a response on this from Husky.


Mike

2010 KZ Sportsmen Classic 14RB – 2009 RAV4 V6

12:50 pm
February 24, 2012


pfidahospud

Post Falls, Idaho

Member

posts 107

To put in my two cents…I tow my 14RB with a 2010 RAV4 with an aftermarket hitch from Curt (installed at the Toyota dealership), and a WD hitch from Valley.  The tongue weight with two group 24 batteries and a full propane tank is 380# (fresh/gray/black tanks empty). 

I think even if it was just for the ride and not the weight issue, the WD hitch really does help — the car doesn't feel nearly as much as a "wet noddle" going over bumps.  I think distributing the weight more towards the front of the car is also helpful for control purposes.  I chose a "trunnion" style hitch that doesn't hinder the ground clearance at the receiver.  As far as I know, I've never bottomed out, and I do have to go over a pseudo-curb at the driveway to my house.  I completely agree with smilinjohn about the sway control – it's not needed for such a small trailer with a significant amount of tongue weight.  About the unibody issue – Toyota has been asked, and no restriction is listed on any official paperwork anywhere.  To me that seems like a rumor for for Snopes to decipher.

However, even with the WD hitch, the car isn't quite level, so I got an inner-spring airbag system like DougB mentioned (link here) to supplement.  I haven't installed it yet, but really hope to before the first camping trip of the season.  It's probably not that necessary, but would help to keep the headlights a little more level.

Tow-er: 2010 RAV4 3.5L 269 hp V6 with Tow Pkg ~ Tow-ee: 2011 Sportsmen Classic 14RB ~ Director: The wife

7:34 am
February 27, 2012


Mike & Diana

Lake Corpus Christi Texas

Member

posts 93

pfidahospud,

I'm sure you're already aware, but, if not, you should be able to adjust the WD system to a point where the trailer sits almost perfectly level. After recording the appropriate front/rear TV wheel clearance you can adjust both the ball height and sway bar height until both the TV and trailer set almost perfectly level. It takes some time, but the WD system was designed for just such application.

My 19SB and F150 runs / sits level with insignificant change in TV wheel clearance when hitched / unhitched.

8:28 am
February 27, 2012


Mike J

Kingston WA

Member

posts 30

Post edited 3:30 pm – February 27, 2012 by Mike J


pfidahospud said:

To put in my two cents…I tow my 14RB with a 2010 RAV4 with an aftermarket hitch from Curt (installed at the Toyota dealership), and a WD hitch from Valley.  The tongue weight with two group 24 batteries and a full propane tank is 380# (fresh/gray/black tanks empty). 


I saw your photos of this in the "modifications" forum. Curious, what is the weight rating of your Curtis hitch? Mine is:

4,000 lbs, 400 lbs

3,500 lbs, 350 lbs


Mike


2010 KZ Sportsmen Classic 14RB – 2009 RAV4 V6

2:50 pm
February 27, 2012


DougB

Charlotte, NC

Member

posts 31

Mike J said:

pfidahospud said:

To put in my two cents…I tow my 14RB with a 2010 RAV4 with an aftermarket hitch from Curt (installed at the Toyota dealership), and a WD hitch from Valley.  The tongue weight with two group 24 batteries and a full propane tank is 380# (fresh/gray/black tanks empty). 


I saw your photos of this in the "modifications" forum. Curious, what is the weight rating of your Curtis hitch? Mine is:

4,000 lbs, 400 lbs

3,500 lbs, 350 lbs


Mike



Personally I wouldn't exceed Toyota's 3,500 lbs, 350 lbs limit.  I have the OEM hitch and it's correct that Toyota doesn't say anything at all about WD systems.  But it does not say using one will increase the weight limits. 

There's a lot of debate on the RAV4 forums about OEM vs. aftermarket hitches that is probably better left there. But I installed the OEM one myself and it has 20 blots with stiffener plates that attach to various points on the body that Toyota must have put there for a reason. And if it doesn't increase the weight limits with WD I don't see how an aftermarket one would.  I haven't looked at all of them but the one's I have seen only have 4 bolts and I'd be very surprised it they don't have disclaimers about exceeding the Toyota's weight limits.

Of course these are just my own conclusions.

Doug

2010 16BH; RAV4 V6

5:52 pm
February 27, 2012


pfidahospud

Post Falls, Idaho

Member

posts 107

Post edited 4:24 pm – March 2, 2012 by pfidahospud


Mike & Diana – You're right that the WD hitch should make the vehicle horizontal, and have got me thinking.  Right now I've got the chain links as short as the directions suggest to avoid binding, and I was thinking that's all it could do.  Maybe I need to adjust the number of washers on the head assembly portion to change the tilt angle?  The hitch is rated for more than 100# over what the actual weight is, so I should try that I think.  Thanks for the suggestion.

MikeJ – The receiver on my RAV is a Curt model #13509, which lists a gross trailer weight limit of 3500# and 350# tongue weight without WD, and 4000#/400# with WD.  I would not necessarily argue that just because the hitch is rated for 400# that the vehicle's limit is thus raised to 400# (but I don't think it hurts).

DougB – I completely agree that the 350# hitch weight limit for the RAV should not be exceeded, with or without a WD hitch.  Showing the novice that I am, I trusted the sticker on the door of the trailer, and thought I was purchasing something within the limits of the vehicle (I further made things worse in this respect by adding a second battery).  We accomodate by putting heavy items toward the back of the trailer (which does help with the hitch weight) and use the WD hitch.  I guess the 30# difference is just my personal liability.  I don't have any experience at all comparing hitch frames other than the dealership said there was no real difference between OEM and the aftermarket hitches they sold (I thought they said they even bolted the frame the same way at the same locations?).  I'm sure your advice is very appropriate, especially for new people looking into the options, and recognizing there may be differences.

Tow-er: 2010 RAV4 3.5L 269 hp V6 with Tow Pkg ~ Tow-ee: 2011 Sportsmen Classic 14RB ~ Director: The wife

3:28 pm
February 28, 2012


Mike Magee

near Tulsa OK

Member

posts 204

One factor with WD hitches is that they can be heavy just by themselves.  I think that extra weight is supposed to be added to the trailer's tongue weight to arrive at total hitch weight.  Frown  So if the trailer supplies 325 lbs, for example, that only leaves 25 lbs for that extra steel in the WD hitch.

2008 Toyota Highlander – 2011 Escape E14RB

6:09 pm
April 6, 2012


camphappy

Regina, Canada

Member

posts 27

I am towing a 2011 19SBT with a toyota tacoma V6 ( 5000lb tow capacity).  I've towed the trailer a few times short distances ( under a 100 miles ) and the truck seems to handle the trailer well.  When I picked the trailer up new I had to pull it home about 70 miles in a very strong headwind ( 45 ml/hr) and the truck worked hard but did fine. My question is that I have towed without a WD hitch up to this point and would like to use one along with sway control.  The problem is that my pickup sits quite high and the trailer sits quite low so when I have put on WD hitches the bars are maybe 4-5 inches off the ground and I'm sure they will scrape often.  I've read about flipping the axles and am not really that interested in doing it.  I'm just wondering if I even need a WD hitch or if a weight bearing hitch will do fine?  When towing without WD I do notice the noodle effect @ times but mainly just driving around the city on bumpy roads, but I have never bottomed out.  Also I haven't noticed any sway issues.  The dealership (RV)  says I should just try without the WD hitch and see how it goes?  Any suggestions would be appreciated.Cool

2011 Sportsmen classic 19SBT Towed with 2007 Toyota Tacoma TRD V6 4×4 with 4.0L engine and towing package

7:01 am
April 7, 2012


Mike & Diana

Lake Corpus Christi Texas

Member

posts 93

camphappy said:I am towing a 2011 19SBT with a toyota tacoma V6 ( 5000lb tow capacity).  I've towed the trailer a few times short distances ( under a 100 miles ) and the truck seems to handle the trailer well.  When I picked the trailer up new I had to pull it home about 70 miles in a very strong headwind ( 45 ml/hr) and the truck worked hard but did fine. My question is that I have towed without a WD hitch up to this point and would like to use one along with sway control.  The problem is that my pickup sits quite high and the trailer sits quite low so when I have put on WD hitches the bars are maybe 4-5 inches off the ground and I'm sure they will scrape often.  I've read about flipping the axles and am not really that interested in doing it.  I'm just wondering if I even need a WD hitch or if a weight bearing hitch will do fine?  When towing without WD I do notice the noodle effect @ times but mainly just driving around the city on bumpy roads, but I have never bottomed out.  Also I haven't noticed any sway issues.  The dealership (RV)  says I should just try without the WD hitch and see how it goes?  Any suggestions would be appreciated.Cool


I have the 19SB and I'm a firm believer in the WD / Sway Control system on any small TT. Not only does it add overall safety but maximizes the designed towing characteristics by leveling the TT & TV. You'll notice a big difference w/o the sway control when you get out more in some heavy cross winds, traveling at higher speeds, and when you're passed by a couple of hundred simis doing 75-80 MPH. Heaven forbid, you were towing without one and you were doing about 60 and had a emergecy occur that required you to quickly swerve. The fishtailing could cause a catastrophe.

I don't understand the clearance issue you mentioned. The WD / sway control bars should be no lower then the frame.

9:25 am
April 7, 2012


camphappy

Regina, Canada

Member

posts 27

When I talk about clearance issues I guess what I mean is that I need a shank with a very large drop which seems to put the shank quite low to the ground and the bars are below that level….they just seem to have very little clearance?  

2011 Sportsmen classic 19SBT Towed with 2007 Toyota Tacoma TRD V6 4×4 with 4.0L engine and towing package

9:31 am
April 7, 2012


camphappy

Regina, Canada

Member

posts 27

I've been looking @ the equal-iz-er system ( WD and sway control in one ).  It's pricey but seems like a good product.  Are you familiar with this system?Laugh

2011 Sportsmen classic 19SBT Towed with 2007 Toyota Tacoma TRD V6 4×4 with 4.0L engine and towing package

10:22 am
April 7, 2012


Mike & Diana

Lake Corpus Christi Texas

Member

posts 93

camphappy said:When I talk about clearance issues I guess what I mean is that I need a shank with a very large drop which seems to put the shank quite low to the ground and the bars are below that level….they just seem to have very little clearance?  


I've only got about a foot clearance from the bottom of my hitch assembly.

Haven't had any problems….YET!

10:24 am
April 7, 2012


Mike & Diana

Lake Corpus Christi Texas

Member

posts 93

camphappy said:I've been looking @ the equal-iz-er system ( WD and sway control in one ).  It's pricey but seems like a good product.  Are you familiar with this system?Laugh


I've got the Equalizer 2. I'm very happy with it.

11:45 am
April 7, 2012


camphappy

Regina, Canada

Member

posts 27

Thanks for the input on the matter.  I think I will definitely go with the WD hitch and sway control.  Better to be safe than sorry.Laugh

2011 Sportsmen classic 19SBT Towed with 2007 Toyota Tacoma TRD V6 4×4 with 4.0L engine and towing package